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Francis's comments "'Empirical Fact' That Many Clergy Are Gay" (homosexuality)

posted by Zedinhim(R), 08.12.2015

Zed speaks in bold, Fezik82 keeps original text.

God is concerned with a particular people... Israel is His bride. You said it yourself,>Did I say that? NO!! ironically within your refusal to acknowledge that He does have a chosen nation.>No I did not REFUSE TO ACKNOWLEDGE that either. You said first that, "the new covenant, in contrast to the old, is not concerned with a particular nation, nor is it concerned with any nation as a whole.>Correct. Rather it is concerned with individuals, regardless of their nation">Correct, now you re catching on. only to go on and cite Hebrews 8:10-13's fulfilment of the promise made with "the house of Israel". You say that we do not need obedience to a set of laws because God put His laws in the hearts of (*note*) the children of ISRAEL. Make that make sense to me.. 1)> The covenant (old) were directed only to the nation of Israel. In order for the covenants to be fulfilled, Christ had to accomplish the atonement, His sacrifice of Himself. But, by His Grace that was extended beyond the covenants, and opened the windows of heaven's salvation to the whole race. (See supporting scriptures below)

Galatians 3:29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Acts 2:39
The promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off--for all whom the Lord our God will call."
2 Corinthians 3; 3 You show that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.

Ephesians 2:19
Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God's people and also members of his household,

Galatians 4; 4-7But when the set time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, to redeem those under the law, that we might receive adoption to sonship. Because you are his sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, “Abba, Father.” So you are no longer a slave, but God’s child; and since you are his child, God has made you also an heir.

we don't need laws because we have laws and 2)> through the whole of the Old Covenant there was always one trouble: man's heart was not right with God. The Nation of Israel has an external law written on stone, the Mosaic Law. The law which successfully reveals the character of God also successfully reveals the sinful character of human beings, just as a child’s desire for cookies is increased when Mother says “Don’t touch” so sinful passions are aroused by the law. In the New Covenant the evil is to be remedied and it is being fully met in the believer’s life by the indwelling Spirit. Its central promise is a heart delighting in God's law that is internally written on the believer’s heart, it says “I won’t touch”, it’s a more excellent remedy.
God does not have a chosen people, but individuals who just so happen to only come from the house of Israel? This is what you believe, huh?>Seems like there is a huge difference from Old to New Testament.

Re: priests, you're right... we do not need priests to mediate between God and individuals with the exception of Christ, our High Priest. As I have pointed out to you once before, priests are submissive to God and have no strength in themselves... they minister as an act of obedience, not power. They do as they have been commanded, and if only you find the time to read the pastoral letters then you will see.>See exactly what? I’ve read “The Pastoral Letters” multiple times, I see nothing about a hierarchy, authoritarian leadership, or Old Testament priests teaching the masses that they alone have such POWER to absolve sins. Neither do I see anything about OT priests having all authority to excusive scripture translation, nor anything about a physical buildings you call churches. (Fezik> they do as they have been commanded.) Commanded!! By who? Or rather which god? Hint:

Do you believe that the priests in Revelation are acting as mediators.. or are they acting as ministerial servants?> Christ has made BELIEVERS kings and priests to God and his Father. As such they overcome the world, govern their own spirits, resist Satan, prevail with God in prayer, and shall judge the world. He has made them priests, given them access to God, enabled them to offer spiritual and acceptable sacrifices. Some are gifted to be ministers but never mediators or co mediators between God and man. 1 Peter 2:5
YOU ALSO, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

However, there is a fine line between mediator and messenger. For example, 2 Corinthians 5:20.. Paul states that they are ambassadors for Christ, beseeching the congregation on Christ's behalf. "Ambassador".. that's a profound choice of translation! They are sent from another government, a foreign land, to preach in order to reconcile us to God.. Yet there is only one Mediator. Perhaps that's why this verse generally cross references Malachi 2:7 suggesting that priests are not mediators, but "messengers". >Seems like you like to distort scripture. OT priests wore many different hats including mediation between God and His people as well as messengers. And yes there is only one mediator since Calvary, yet you speak as if you didn’t know. Duhh!!! It seems not much has changed from the Old Testament to the New...>Paul with the other apostles were “ambassadors” in other words “authorized representatives or messengers” for Christ. They were inspired by the Holy Ghost, they were given the privilege of telling the Gentiles about the endless treasures available to them in Christ. Eph 3: 8,9 “Though I am the least deserving of all God’s people, he graciously gave me the privilege of TELLING THE GENTILES about the endless treasures available to them in Christ. 9 I WAS CHOSEN TO EXPLAIN TO EVERYONE this mysterious plan that God, the Creator of all things, had kept secret from the beginning.”( notice how Paul’s message from above is intended for everyone, not exclusive.) The apostles were not OT type priests.
Lastly, you wrote:

"The congregation is the pillar AND SUPPORT of God’s Word”. Why did you omit those two words changing the outcome of Gods truth into a lie? Why are you so bent on being counterproductive to God? Do you not fear Him? And you’re trying to get me to agree with you again"

I hid nothing, I paraphrased..>Yes you paraphrased :( (online dictionary) “The adaptation or alteration of a text or quotation to serve a different purpose from that of the original.” though it supports my understanding all the more once you added "and support". How does this change the "outcome of Gods truth" in your opinion? What is a pillar. The true question here is.. if you are truly a member of the congregation, how do you receive God's Word in order to become the pillar (aka "support")? In just the same way as Luther, Wesley, Calvin and all of those others who could not come to agreement on the whole of the Scriptures if their lives depended on it?> What has changed? From The time of The Apostles, they had similar issues way back then. You seem to make a big song and dance about it and yet you too have many disagreements within your own church. It so happens the answers to deal those issues is found in scripture. You admit that God does not automatically transmit all truth to you... then how do you receive your truth? > I receive some truth no one receives ALL truth, not even Paul had attained it all.>Those who claim to have all truth are the hallmarks of a cult, see here:

Through your own understanding? "Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding" (Proverbs 3:5). One or the other... which is it? [b]>To Trust in the LORD is to confide in, "to set one's hope and confidence upon." He is the living God that became the Word, so yes I put all my trust in the LORD, Why don’t you trust the lord rather than your OT type pope/priests with all their traditions of men, they even consider it to be equal to the inspired living Word.

>It’s obvious you are not here for the Truth; you have a competitive quest to blow off my responses even if it means distorting my words and Gods Words, I have provided irrefutable Truth from scripture that supports my stand. I fear that your heart has been hardened too much for too long. The world is perishing and all you want is to prove to me that you are in good hands trusting in your OT religious, physical church. Remember come that day, judgement day when you meet your maker, your pope/priests won’t be with you to defend you, Jesus is your only hope, stop your semantics’, stop defending man and start defending Him and He will defend you before The Father. Lets discuss more when you have a turn in heart and you are wanting to seek truth. Tm out. [/b]


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